Am I AC or DC??

[smelonas]

I think its buried somewhere in here, but I am not able to find it..

I bought a new baja design headlight for my bike, had some cheap chinese KLX450 reproduction headlight on my bike from when we swapped forks. Well, that thing didnt even last one summer before most of the straps rotted and broke or the thing just sucked so much it pissed me off. So anyway, finally got an honest replacement and an 85W Ricky Stator, light needs 80w to drive it, and just for grins I ordered the light that came with the rectifier included with it. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that the bike should and IIRC does have one on it.

One, it should be able to support the added wattage, right? Its the little black cube on the airbox lid right?
Two, anyone have experience with these lights? Thing looks like a million bucks, so I am excited to give it working and setup!

Will share photos as it comes along!

Thanks again.

[Slick_Nick]

The KDX electrical system is AC only. The black box is the CDI. The gray one with the fins is the regulator. Regulator only, no rectifier.

[SS109]

Mmm, probably is not going to work near as good as you'd like. Does the light require DC current? If so, and your AC has to be rectified, your wattage gets cut in half. So, now your 85 watt AC stator is roughly 42-43 watts DC. You would get better performance if you ran a light that didn't need DC current or rectify the ac and getting a high quality LED setup that draws up to 40 watts for maximum light output.

[smelonas]

Mmm, probably is not going to work near as good as you'd like. Does the light require DC current? If so, and your AC has to be rectified, your wattage gets cut in half. So, now your 85 watt AC stator is roughly 42-43 watts DC. You would get better performance if you ran a light that didn't need DC current or rectify the ac and getting a high quality LED setup that draws up to 40 watts for maximum light output.

Gon' find out real soon if this is going to work I guess...

[Slick_Nick]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

[smelonas]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

This is half the issue. The Baja design squadron light, the actual light fixture, uses 100% drive 'technology'. So, its either on, or off. No in between. So I need to get this wired up quick so I can figure out what I need to do in order to make it work, or just scrap the idea all together and go with the 'sport version' which pulls less than 30W. Thinking I might be better off to just nix this plan right now while I still have everything and just get that.

Thoughts? I am always game for on the fly changes. Unfortunately, I dont know much about lighting on bikes other than huge stators and LEDs

[SS109]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

-Ok, let me preface my following statement by saying a lot of this is theoretical but also has a basis in actual use by my own experiences running LEDs on my older '90 KDX and various small projects over the years. I am by no means an electrical engineer and don't know everything when it comes to LEDs. I am only sharing what I have learned by reading and personal experimentation-

That's not a problem unless you are running a higher wattage light than you have DC watts (current) at idle and then it just normally won't turn on. Where I've personally seen the real issue of LED flickering is when running an LED light on AC (it can be done as an LED is a diode itself) without being rectified or the current draw is too high at idle. The problem with AC is not that you don't have enough watts it is the fact that the current actually reverses so 12vac+ to 12vac- and back again, over and over. A standard filament type bulb doesn't care as long as it is getting current, whether positive or negative, whereas an LED is a a one way valve only wanting positive.

Hope that made sense.

[smelonas]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

-Ok, let me preface my following statement by saying a lot of this is theoretical but also has a basis in actual use by my own experiences running LEDs on my older '90 KDX and various small projects over the years. I am by no means an electrical engineer and don't know everything when it comes to LEDs. I am only sharing what I have learned by reading and personal experimentation-

That's not a problem unless you are running a higher wattage light than you have DC watts (current) at idle and then it just normally won't turn on. Where I've personally seen the real issue of LED flickering is when running an LED light on AC (it can be done as an LED is a diode itself) without being rectified or the current draw is too high at idle. The problem with AC is not that you don't have enough watts it is the fact that the current actually reverses so 12vac+ to 12vac- and back again, over and over. A standard filament type bulb doesn't care as long as it is getting current, whether positive or negative, whereas an LED is a a one way valve only wanting positive.

Hope that made sense.

And technically, LEDs always flash, thats why they never 'film' correctly. They are always flashing in videos if you have noticed. They just flash fast enough most of the time that the human eye cant detect it once its above a threshold.

[Slick_Nick]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

This is half the issue. The Baja design squadron light, the actual light fixture, uses 100% drive 'technology'. So, its either on, or off. No in between. So I need to get this wired up quick so I can figure out what I need to do in order to make it work, or just scrap the idea all together and go with the 'sport version' which pulls less than 30W. Thinking I might be better off to just nix this plan right now while I still have everything and just get that.

Thoughts? I am always game for on the fly changes. Unfortunately, I dont know much about lighting on bikes other than huge stators and LEDs

Begs the question, why do all this dicking around trying to make some goofy LED lighting system work? Just run a high output incandescent bulb?

Check my stator thread for info but I was able to run two 55W H7 headlight bulbs. You could run a 110W H4 instead and have both filaments active.

[smelonas]

Won’t it cause the LED light to flicker a lot since half of the electrical waveform is essentially dropped?

This is half the issue. The Baja design squadron light, the actual light fixture, uses 100% drive 'technology'. So, its either on, or off. No in between. So I need to get this wired up quick so I can figure out what I need to do in order to make it work, or just scrap the idea all together and go with the 'sport version' which pulls less than 30W. Thinking I might be better off to just nix this plan right now while I still have everything and just get that.

Thoughts? I am always game for on the fly changes. Unfortunately, I dont know much about lighting on bikes other than huge stators and LEDs

Begs the question, why do all this dicking around trying to make some goofy LED lighting system work? Just run a high output incandescent bulb?

Check my stator thread for info but I was able to run two 55W H7 headlight bulbs. You could run a 110W H4 instead and have both filaments active.

Well.. I want an LED light, I need a new housing, and I want something simple and I have KX forks. The challenge doesnt bother me, and yeah, it sounds like a pain, but its also the off season as we already hit over 100 yesterday. So, the bikes are officially down for the summer.

[Slick_Nick]

Well then you're in luck because I also wrote a how-to on using a KLX450R style headlight (which will work with KX forks) and converting it to accept a traditional incandescent lamp, in addition to the stator rewind. Don't have to use the same housing that I did, but maybe it'll give you an idea. You'll have a more robust system, and much better light output than an LED.

Keep in mind I wrote this over a decade ago, but you get the idea. Light is still going strong to this day!

viewtopic.php?t=12111

[smelonas]

Well then you're in luck because I also wrote a how-to on using a KLX450R style headlight (which will work with KX forks) and converting it to accept a traditional incandescent lamp, in addition to the stator rewind. Don't have to use the same housing that I did, but maybe it'll give you an idea. You'll have a more robust system, and much better light output than an LED.

Keep in mind I wrote this over a decade ago, but you get the idea. Light is still going strong to this day!

viewtopic.php?t=12111

For all intents and purposes, I could build that exact setup with the stuff I have. I have the headlight and housing, but I am just not with it. I dont know what it is.

Looking at your stator rewind again and I am wondering if the ricky stator will produce a similar wattage. And literally it could be the difference of one more row of windings that would boost that extra 10 or watts. I also wonder if RS rates their wattage on the low side. Only one way to find out and Im still waiting for my buddy to drop off that flywheel puller. Otherwise, I would have already started on this.

Your setup is pretty sweet.. That was forward thinking at the time, even today its still an awesome idea! Its almost a shame that I am so particular/picky about every little thing I do.

[Slick_Nick]

I am too which is why I do everything myself. I think the Ricky stator is around 70-75W? I tested mine up to 103W and over the years I’ve also tried a few different iterations, using different gauge wire, etc. Also recently did a new ignition stator as well. Learned a lot.

Look here viewtopic.php?f=77&t=25335

[SS109]

Your setup is pretty sweet.. That was forward thinking at the time, even today its still an awesome idea! Its almost a shame that I am so particular/picky about every little thing I do.

All I'll say is give your thanks to Nick for having that Ricky Stator high output lighting coil. No one, and I do mean no one, offered a lighting coil that put out more than 35 watts for the KDX before Nick scienced it out and then places like RS just copied his work. I remember people on here, including myself, asking places like RS if we could get a higher output lighting coil and they would say it wasn't possible. They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery but I think they all were just lazy and didn't care to look in to it. If it wasn't for Nick they still wouldn't be available IMO.

As usual, Nick....

[bufftester]

LEDs don't always flash, if provided a true DC current source they stay on. The reason most LED household lighting appears to flicker is because the AC rectifiers are not putting out constant current DC, you get ripple, or small current dropouts at the AC frequency. Generally it is faster than you can normally perceive so it's not considered an issue by most manufacturers. This is of course the exact problem you have on the bike...no true DC constant current output from the rectifier.

However, the Baja Designs kit comes with their AC/DC converter, so just wire it up per their directions and ride. Generally Baja Designs requires you to float the ground and isolate your lighting circuit completely from the ignition circuit. Not difficult to do, lost of info on here about it.

[smelonas]

I am too which is why I do everything myself. I think the Ricky stator is around 70-75W? I tested mine up to 103W and over the years I’ve also tried a few different iterations, using different gauge wire, etc. Also recently did a new ignition stator as well. Learned a lot.

Look here viewtopic.php?f=77&t=25335

Thats pretty legit.

Did you ever test the RS coil for spark/voltage? Guess I am curious if they improved the design at all.

Does the bike ride/run better with the rewound coil? I am considering going along and doing all deutsch connectors on my KDX and the hybrid for that custom and cool look and this would be a fantastic addition to that project.

How did you spool the thing on the lathe? Just set the speed really low and just feed it?

Awesome to see all the work you have put in. Its like I am 5 years behind on everything, with the exception of that throttle cable guide haha.

[smelonas]

LEDs don't always flash, if provided a true DC current source they stay on. The reason most LED household lighting appears to flicker is because the AC rectifiers are not putting out constant current DC, you get ripple, or small current dropouts at the AC frequency. Generally it is faster than you can normally perceive so it's not considered an issue by most manufacturers. This is of course the exact problem you have on the bike...no true DC constant current output from the rectifier.

However, the Baja Designs kit comes with their AC/DC converter, so just wire it up per their directions and ride. Generally Baja Designs requires you to float the ground and isolate your lighting circuit completely from the ignition circuit. Not difficult to do, lost of info on here about it.

I read and marked a thread that talked about isolating the lighting circuit, another motivation to remap the electrical system how I want. I didnt realize the potential of these bikes until a short time ago. I am just now getting into some really good stuff.

[smelonas]

So I went ahead and got the lower output light as I didnt want to worry about wattage. Go to wire it up and I realize that I have no idea what I doing. Took seat off to be able to trace wires and follow them, easy enough, AC wiring makes sense.

My only question is, do i just wire this light up as normal? Yellow to red(chassis) and white to black(chassis)? Leaving the regulator in place of course, but will the taillight work with this wired in? Do I need to eliminate it?

20220605_122439.jpg (2.13 MiB) Viewed 3676 times

I read a thread about someone installing a trail tech reg/rec and how they wired it but does that apply in this situation?

I guess it also raises the question of how do I wire the stator too? Will that change anything in the event that I need to move grounds/eliminate taillight?

In my head, I am assuming that the rectifier on the light will stand alone and just needs hooked up, but god help me if I am wrong and zap my bike