Splitting the case oh what fun!
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
Splitting the case oh what fun!
Had to split the case on my 220 over the weekend, is that ever a pain. I needed to replace two bearings and I went ahead and did all the seals. I put in a new wiseco piston and ring, the factory piston had a crack in it! All is good and it runs real nice now but I have no desire to split another case for a long time.
- Indawoods
- Creator and Founder
- Posts: 9951
- Joined: 09:59 am Jun 12 2003
- Country:
- Location: Midwest
The piston issue is no suprise.... take note 220 owners!
Glad you found it before something major happened.....
Glad you found it before something major happened.....
*** Administrator //***
****'95 KDX 200/****
"People ate cows a thousand years ago for the same reason we eat them now. Cause they are easy to catch.We're not savages,we're just lazy. A cheetah could taste like chocolate heroin. But will never know. Those bastards are fast!!! "
****'95 KDX 200/****
"People ate cows a thousand years ago for the same reason we eat them now. Cause they are easy to catch.We're not savages,we're just lazy. A cheetah could taste like chocolate heroin. But will never know. Those bastards are fast!!! "
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
- canyncarvr
- Gold Member
- Posts: 6943
- Joined: 01:07 pm Nov 05 2004
- Country: US
- Location: The Mythical State of Jefferson
Did you use a case splitting tool? A bearing press? Or..just a gear/balancer puller and a vise?
Which two bearings? Crank?
You replaced them due to a known problem (excessive play) or just 'cuz?
One more?.....
Re: '..found it..' You knew the piston was bad, or found the crack whilst doing some other remedial service?
The failing 220 piston issue has been called an 'internet myth' by some. Those familiar with the KDX know better. It's been the Achille's heel of the 220 from the beginning.
Good deal! Congratulations on saving your bike from imminent destruction!!
Which two bearings? Crank?
You replaced them due to a known problem (excessive play) or just 'cuz?
One more?.....
Re: '..found it..' You knew the piston was bad, or found the crack whilst doing some other remedial service?
The failing 220 piston issue has been called an 'internet myth' by some. Those familiar with the KDX know better. It's been the Achille's heel of the 220 from the beginning.
Good deal! Congratulations on saving your bike from imminent destruction!!
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
bike profile: !clicky!
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
Did not have a case splitting tool or a press but I did have a home built flywheel puller. The bearings I replaced were the output shaft bearing at the sprocket and the bearing right in front of it on the end of the input shaft next to second gear. The reason I replaced the bearings was a terrible growling noise that turned out to be the needle bearing on the end of the input shaft or lack of that bearing. When I found out I was going to have to go into the case I knew I was going to put in a new piston and ring because I was already down that far. When I tore it apart and saw it was an original piston I started inspecting it (because of stuff said on this site). I found a hairline crack at the bottom of the piston just under one of the small holes in the piston if you try and spread it by pushing on the piston skirt you can open the crack slightly. It's all done now and running great, it's nice to have the peace of mind that comes with the Wiseco piston.
To all with a 220r please do not wait to do the piston in your bike, it truly is a time bomb and could cause you a lot of time and money to fix.
To all with a 220r please do not wait to do the piston in your bike, it truly is a time bomb and could cause you a lot of time and money to fix.
- kawagumby
- Gold Member
- Posts: 927
- Joined: 10:09 am Nov 30 2006
- Country:
- Location: California
I've found that is the most likely tranny bearing to fail on a KDX.Mobilized1 wrote:. The reason I replaced the bearings was a terrible growling noise that turned out to be the needle bearing on the end of the input shaft or lack of that bearing. .
1994 KDX200, Beta 200rr, yz125, yz250, kx100 modded for adult, gasgas contact 250.
- canyncarvr
- Gold Member
- Posts: 6943
- Joined: 01:07 pm Nov 05 2004
- Country: US
- Location: The Mythical State of Jefferson
Thanks much for the further info.
How 'bout getting that needle bearing out? Being in a blind hole, bearings of that sort can be tough to get out.
Did'ja use Yamabond on the cases?
Anyway...glad to hear you found it before it blew up.
How 'bout getting that needle bearing out? Being in a blind hole, bearings of that sort can be tough to get out.
Did'ja use Yamabond on the cases?
Anyway...glad to hear you found it before it blew up.
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
bike profile: !clicky!
- Colorado Mike
- Gold Member
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 11:42 am Feb 25 2005
- Country:
- Location: Colorado
- canyncarvr
- Gold Member
- Posts: 6943
- Joined: 01:07 pm Nov 05 2004
- Country: US
- Location: The Mythical State of Jefferson
Got a weblink for it?
I have a blind hole seal puller with one 'finger' on it and an offset striker pad you beat (tap?) on with a hammer.
As often as I'd use it, I suppose THIS would work.
I much prefer a quality tool over something from HF..but frequency of use fits in somewhere. Besides, the last screw extractor set I got from a quality outfit (that cost $$) was crap.
But... the 1/2"impact metric set I got from HF I use all the time, and it has performed flawlessly.
So...what'cha gonna do?
I have a blind hole seal puller with one 'finger' on it and an offset striker pad you beat (tap?) on with a hammer.
As often as I'd use it, I suppose THIS would work.
I much prefer a quality tool over something from HF..but frequency of use fits in somewhere. Besides, the last screw extractor set I got from a quality outfit (that cost $$) was crap.
But... the 1/2"impact metric set I got from HF I use all the time, and it has performed flawlessly.
So...what'cha gonna do?
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
bike profile: !clicky!
- Colorado Mike
- Gold Member
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 11:42 am Feb 25 2005
- Country:
- Location: Colorado
I feel exactly the same way, which is why I use exactly that same slide hammer kit. For the price of the name brands, I can buy ten of those HF units as they break.
If I did this crap every day for a living, I might think differently.
If I did this crap every day for a living, I might think differently.
Mike
Life's tough, it's even tougher if you're stupid.
'04 KDX220
Life's tough, it's even tougher if you're stupid.
'04 KDX220
- TWMOODY
- Gold Member
- Posts: 752
- Joined: 08:10 pm Dec 01 2006
- Country:
- Location: Southeast , Michigan
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
I did use Yamabond on the case, there was not much left of the needle bearing so all I pulled out was the outside casing of the bearing all the rest was gone. What was left of the bearing came out without any problems with some needle nose pliars.canyncarvr wrote:Thanks much for the further info.
How 'bout getting that needle bearing out? Being in a blind hole, bearings of that sort can be tough to get out.
Did'ja use Yamabond on the cases?
Anyway...glad to hear you found it before it blew up.
- canyncarvr
- Gold Member
- Posts: 6943
- Joined: 01:07 pm Nov 05 2004
- Country: US
- Location: The Mythical State of Jefferson
That bearing sits in oil all the time, doesn't it?
Uh...where'd all the liddle needles go? Chewed up in bits and now embedded in your clutch plates for extra stickage?
Uh...where'd all the liddle needles go? Chewed up in bits and now embedded in your clutch plates for extra stickage?
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
bike profile: !clicky!
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
There was alot of fine metal shavings in the oil when I drained it and no needles or chunks of needles at all. I inspected all the clutch plates and they looked like new so all I did was smooth up the clutch basket a little with some emery cloth and slap it back together. I'm not sure that the needle bearing actually sit in oil all the time I think it may be a bit too high for that but I am not positive of that.canyncarvr wrote:That bearing sits in oil all the time, doesn't it?
Uh...where'd all the liddle needles go? Chewed up in bits and now embedded in your clutch plates for extra stickage?
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
- TWMOODY
- Gold Member
- Posts: 752
- Joined: 08:10 pm Dec 01 2006
- Country:
- Location: Southeast , Michigan
I would look at it like this...........
The fact that the stock piston was still in it tells you a little
about the previous owner, Right ??
Did he ever change the oil ? Who knows.....
Now, the fact is you have had it apart, inspected the internal
components, replaced what you thought needed replacing and
starting off with a new piston and rings and a good running
2 smoker. Now your done with that next on your list is checking
and greasing or replacing all the suspension bearings and changing
out your fork and shock oils and you will have yourself a good
dependable bike!
Right ??
I always want to know the condition of everything before I set out on
a 70 mile ride so I'm not the one being towed back......
The fact that the stock piston was still in it tells you a little
about the previous owner, Right ??
Did he ever change the oil ? Who knows.....
Now, the fact is you have had it apart, inspected the internal
components, replaced what you thought needed replacing and
starting off with a new piston and rings and a good running
2 smoker. Now your done with that next on your list is checking
and greasing or replacing all the suspension bearings and changing
out your fork and shock oils and you will have yourself a good
dependable bike!
Right ??
I always want to know the condition of everything before I set out on
a 70 mile ride so I'm not the one being towed back......
-
- Member
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 02:53 pm Jul 14 2009
- Country:
True!TWMOODY wrote:I would look at it like this...........
The fact that the stock piston was still in it tells you a little
about the previous owner, Right ??
Did he ever change the oil ? Who knows.....
Now, the fact is you have had it apart, inspected the internal
components, replaced what you thought needed replacing and
starting off with a new piston and rings and a good running
2 smoker. Now your done with that next on your list is checking
and greasing or replacing all the suspension bearings and changing
out your fork and shock oils and you will have yourself a good
dependable bike!
Right ??
I always want to know the condition of everything before I set out on
a 70 mile ride so I'm not the one being towed back......
- canyncarvr
- Gold Member
- Posts: 6943
- Joined: 01:07 pm Nov 05 2004
- Country: US
- Location: The Mythical State of Jefferson
Ignorance is bliss.......
I appreciate the idea of decent maintenance, preventive maintenance, and generally taking care of things.
But...I don't want to dwell on the Type-A nature of REAL good maintainers...like kawag replacing all his case bearings as part of his routine maintenance. I do admire a rider that goes to that trouble and extent..but it's not me. I'm 'fraid that if I think TOO much about stuff like that..bad things will happen!!
I'll wait 'til I have a reason to fuss with it....I think.
An ostrich point of view? Could well be. I'm not saying it's a GOOD idea!
I've put a few top-ends in my KDX..and have YET to clean the KIPS! It works..it's not full of crud...heck..it's clean! So why fuss with it?
So...I don't.
I've had it apart a couple of times to inspect or replace parts..but I just wiped the old parts off and put 'em back in.
I'm not sayin' there was no carbon nowhere..but nothing that affected its operation.
Maybe I should be ashamed.............
But...not me, man!
And...btw...I'm getting REAL tired of editing fixes for using 'it's' when I should've used 'its'. I never used to make that error...now its damn near every post!!!
...maybe it's not that I never used to..just never paid no attention......
I appreciate the idea of decent maintenance, preventive maintenance, and generally taking care of things.
But...I don't want to dwell on the Type-A nature of REAL good maintainers...like kawag replacing all his case bearings as part of his routine maintenance. I do admire a rider that goes to that trouble and extent..but it's not me. I'm 'fraid that if I think TOO much about stuff like that..bad things will happen!!
I'll wait 'til I have a reason to fuss with it....I think.
An ostrich point of view? Could well be. I'm not saying it's a GOOD idea!
I've put a few top-ends in my KDX..and have YET to clean the KIPS! It works..it's not full of crud...heck..it's clean! So why fuss with it?
So...I don't.
I've had it apart a couple of times to inspect or replace parts..but I just wiped the old parts off and put 'em back in.
I'm not sayin' there was no carbon nowhere..but nothing that affected its operation.
Maybe I should be ashamed.............
But...not me, man!
And...btw...I'm getting REAL tired of editing fixes for using 'it's' when I should've used 'its'. I never used to make that error...now its damn near every post!!!
...maybe it's not that I never used to..just never paid no attention......
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
bike profile: !clicky!
- kawagumby
- Gold Member
- Posts: 927
- Joined: 10:09 am Nov 30 2006
- Country:
- Location: California
Well, not exactly. I only replaced them all when they needed it, and, really it's just cheap insurance when the cases are split anyway. Two full riding years of hard riding invariably produced notchy shifting that new bearings fix. Believe me, I don't like working on anything that I don't have to either. Plus the older I get, the more I don't like doin' the same unfun things over and over - that kinda short-changes experiencing what other stuff our limited life has to offer. The only time I clean my power valves is when I do a top end....and jeez, I used to worry about it's vs its too. Heh, the aging process....brings to mind a greater reality.canyncarvr wrote:Ignorance is bliss.......
But...I don't want to dwell on the Type-A nature of REAL good maintainers...like kawag replacing all his case bearings as part of his routine maintenance. s:
1994 KDX200, Beta 200rr, yz125, yz250, kx100 modded for adult, gasgas contact 250.