H model kips issue

[JZ05220r]

I have been concerned about the power valve actuation on my 220 for quite some time. I looked below the cover while it’s running and although it does spin normally with rising rpms, their is play somewhere. It is completely free of any preload/spring pressure until about the point that I have shown in the picture. Most of the time It doesn’t return with the ball and spring lining up within the recess on the gear after the rpms come down as their is no spring pressure for it to do so. I noticed that the KIPs valves closed much slower after the rebuild as well. (Videos below) I have checked to make sure the valves open as soon as the gear is turned so their doesn’t seem to be any play within the gear teeth. I checked by taking the exhaust off and putting a wrench on the nut and lightly moving. 1. It is completely free of spring pressure/or preload up until the point of the picture, actually a bit past the point in the pic. 2. Sub port valves and flapper are just starting to crack open in the picture which confirmed that their isn’t any play within the gear teeth of the lips valves etc. Hope this makes sense. What can I check/change? I also noticed it was normal before the rebuild. Before rebuild KIPs inspection: https://m.youtube.com/shorts/lyTetL7EbKc After rebuild KIPs inspection: https://m.youtube.com/shorts/IKo1wl_UShQ Thank you guys

[SS109]

Do you have the the governor rod to pawl adjustment set to return it back to the closed position?

[JZ05220r]

Do you have the the governor rod to pawl adjustment set to return it back to the closed position?

Yes all the gears are aligned correctly.

[SS109]

The governor is what closes the valves. If it isn't returning to the rest/closed position then the problem could be with it. Well, unless something is physically restricting them from closing in the cylinder. BTW, looks very dry in there as well. Did you lube everything like the manual says?

[JZ05220r]

The governor is what closes the valves. If it isn't returning to the rest/closed position then the problem could be with it. Well, unless something is physically restricting them from closing in the cylinder. BTW, looks very dry in there as well. Did you lube everything like the manual says?

I didn’t assemble the engine. Jeff Fredette assembled it. So I just assume that it was lubed correctly. Thanks

[SS109]

Ah, that's right. I forgot he built it.

I would see if you can get it to close fully by hand with a socket on the nut. It shouldn't take much pressure (DON"T FORCE IT!) at all to fully close it. See if you feel it hanging up on anything or is gritty feeling. I would also check the other side of the KIPS and see if the KIPS rod is fully retracting when you chop the throttle.

[JZ05220r]

Ah, that's right. I forgot he built it.

I would see if you can get it to close fully by hand with a socket on the nut. It shouldn't take much pressure (DON"T FORCE IT!) at all to fully close it. See if you feel it hanging up on anything or is gritty feeling. I would also check the other side of the KIPS and see if the KIPS rod is fully retracting when you chop the throttle.

It takes very little force to get it to close all of the way. Haven’t checked the right side while running yet, but I have (and I know you probably shouldn’t be doing this) checked the kip rod paw gear with a wrench and it doesn’t return all the way on its own just like the gear on the left side. But both right side paw gear and left side inspection gear have rotational play. And both sides can move the valves closed easily by hand. Here’s a few videos. I feela bit ridiculous making these but I know it will help visually explain it. Thanks. Thinking of replacing the advancer spring, 4 balls and the oring.

[JZ05220r]

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/0Pj_YC7llDA https://m.youtube.com/shorts/DrwQk8t_yog

[SS109]

If the pawl is tight, and in proper alignment, then something is wrong with the KIPS pin or the governor itself.

[JZ05220r]

If the pawl is tight, and in proper alignment, then something is wrong with the KIPS pin or the governor itself.

Ok I’ll check the governor and replace the pin and see what happens. I saw this old post on dirt rider. https://dirtrider.net/forums3/threads/k ... el.110142/ It’s not the exact same issue but sounds similar. The pin was supposedly replaced, you never know. Thank you

[bufftester]

It appears to be a governor/pin issue as stated by others. Pull the right side inner cover and verify the state of the pin and the governor with all its springs and thrust bearings

[JZ05220r]

It appears to be a governor/pin issue as stated by others. Pull the right side inner cover and verify the state of the pin and the governor with all its springs and thrust bearings

Going to replace the pin and the governor spring, balls and orings. See what that does. Thanks

[JZ05220r]

Curious if anyone with an h model would verify how far they can turn the gear counter clockwise under the left hand Kip inspection cap before they start to feel the return spring pressure. Thank you.

[Molly's 70]

I have a complete cylinder on my shelf. Never been disassembled from the factory. I don't feel any return spring pressure.

[JZ05220r]

I have a complete cylinder on my shelf. Never been disassembled from the factory. I don't feel any return spring pressure.

I understand that if the cylinder were off the bike their wouldn’t be any spring pressure because the advancer shaft is disconnected to the rest of the kips components. Thank you for checking.

[bufftester]

There should be very little movement before you feel resistance...that's why the pin gets broken so often by folks that don't know theres a left handed thread on the pawl nut

[JZ05220r]

Tonight was a late one working on the 05 Kdx. Disconnected the left hand nut and paw gear, removed right side cover, replaced the spring and kips pin, removed the head, and checked that the sub valves are in fact lined up correctly. Check the kips operation with the left hand nut and gear disconnected. Still fails to return fully. Can anyone truly confirm that this isn’t normal by using a 10mm on the left side kips gear, turning it counterclockwise and seeing where the gear ends up in relation to the spring and ball? Only things I can think of now are the right side cover gasket is too thick causing the shaft to engage at a further point or the kips shaft is twisted. Thanks

[JZ05220r]

Almost positive I figured the problem out. With the left hand nut loose you can move the pawl around to the left or right regardless of the fact that their is a retaining pin. I found the I have been tighten the left handed but while holding the pawl with an adjustable wrench. By the time the left handed nut was tight the pawl was clocked more toward the right which made the valves slight cracked open. If I make sure the pawl is pulled all the way to the left while tightening the left hand nut it seemed to get rid of the problem. Barely any play once I snugged it up. Can’t find my 6mm wrench to hold the shaft anywhere but once I find it I will be able to tighten the not all the way.

[KDXGarage]

Good news! Congratulations on getting it sorted.

[JZ05220r]

Before: https://m.youtube.com/shorts/RcoYjbTR2II. —- After: https://m.youtube.com/shorts/vx7kVTPHrPg Thanks to you all for the help