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gertie6car wrote:only way I can see to make this work is to add a battery to supply the DRC unit and leave the standard output to power ignition and front light. I really dont want to have to do this if I can avoid it!

Cheers

Gert

Yes in your case I would avoid this as well. SEems like alot of work just to get a brakelight working. What type of brake switch are you using? If it is the type that puts a resistance in the line, then this is not the type you want. But if you are using a normal switch and its still doing this the only thing I can think is happening is that when you add the extra load of the other set of LEDS for the brake light then you are bringing the total voltage too low thus not allowing the brighter LEDS to work. If you do go for the battery setup like I did, then seriously look at doing a full street harness to take full advantage of it and to make the bike much more safe on the road.

Looks like I will have to go the battery route, can anyone help me with a battery charging system for the battery route? cheers

Geesh... just go with a proper switch and light setup... you are over complicating things....

A Hydraulic brake switch and dual LED bulb should take you all the way... Works perfect on mine.

Indawoods wrote:Geesh... just go with a proper switch and light setup... you are over complicating things....

A Hydraulic brake switch and dual LED bulb should take you all the way... Works perfect on mine.

I only breezed through this...but Inda I think sums it up well.

I did read that it's a resistive brake light install. That's going to be a problem with an LED setup.

Oh...and this:

IC wrote:Ok Inda - took a look in the maintenance manual and did not see rectifier: MAYBE I AM NOT AS SMART AS I THOUGHT!!

You sure that is not a combination regulator/rectifier which Kawaski just references as a regulator?

You might be 1/2 as smart as you thought...if it was a 1/2 wave rectifier, but unfortunately, it is not.

The KDX runs an AC regulator. Nothing is rectified, it is not a combination regulator/rectumfriar, there is no DC available on the OEM lighting system.

You know it's a regulator 'cuz it has only two wires...and one of them is gnd (pronounced guh-nuhd). A rectifier could not work with two wires. Well, unless one of 'em was running in full duplex.

Hi Indawoods,

The brake switches are hydraulic ones.

The rear bulb is a twin filament set up.

The standard set up works fine BUT the standard set up will not pass the
roadworhyness test as it does not incorporate a licence plate light. Hence the drc unit, being LED and specified to work on 12v AC or DC and having a LED tail, stop and plate set up I thought I was good to go.

Which bit do you think I am over complicating?

A plate light usually consists of a clear bit of plastic on the bottom of the tailight to provide the white light on the plate. Not a completely separate light....

yep! bang on the money there, did think about modding the standard tail light lense but due to its position on the fender the white light needed to illuminate the plate would show from the rear and that is a no no in the uk. The drc unit is all integrated witht he plate light being three white LED's. The guys at DRC have been very helpful and are shipping a new light as they think it might be deffective.

That's cool! Different regulations I suppose.... but you could alway make an opaque deflector for the light so the white light wouldn't show....

My 77 Triumph Bonneville had the same setup as I spoke of however. Probably made for the US market though.....

thanks for the comments, have a great weekend! cheers

Seems you're getting off into the weeds on this deal.

Re: 'When I reconnect to the DRC unit I only get tail and plate, not even a flicker when the brake is depressed! Interestingly if you take the tail light feed and connect it to the brake light it works fine.'


And...'If it is the type that puts a resistance in the line, then this is not the type you want.'

The drc unit is all integrated

That is the problem.


Rewire your brake switch. Get rid of the resistive part of it. From the hot to the tail/license, splice a wire TO the brake switch, then FROM the other switch wire TO the brake light.


IF your brake switch has one wire to GROUND...it's wrong for the above use. If the lights work as they should with another source (battery, as you mentioned), I doubt the lighting unit is the problem. It's more likely the way you have it switched.

___________o Tail/license light
|
hot_|_______._____o Brake light

brake switch


This 'drawing' likely to be wonky. Can't post pics. Get the idea?

**
Yep. Looks nothing in the post like it does in the edit box. The 'hot' is connected to both the tail and the wire TO the brake switch.


Yes. You can wire it like this:

Wire the hot to the SOCKETS, NOT hot to the filaments. Then wire the tail/license filaments to ground, wire the BRAKE filament to the brake switch with the OTHER brake wire going to ground (which is likely the way it's wired NOW). The sockets cannot be grounded by anything (screw, frame) in this situation.


It's a bit more complicated..preferred in a one-socket situation like wiring in an 1157 (two filament) socket. It's more complicated 'cuz you have several sockets with the plate lights. AND, probably not an option considering you said, 'The drc unit is all integrated...'

You have a mix of the two install configurations, I'd guess. You're probably wiring the new lights with the filaments hot, and your existing resistive brake has a brake switch wire going to ground.

...which is why it was said,

If it is the type that puts a resistance in the line, then this is not the type you want

If you have any question, please ask specifically. I know exactly what you want to do, what needs to be done. So...my write-up of it may gloss over some things... 'cuz I take them for granted...'cuz I know the 'things'. Reading it from a standpoint other than that may bring up some questions.

If you have a picture posting website (photobucket or somesuch), make up a drawing of what you have that doesn't work and if there's something wrong with it, I'll edit the pic for 'ya.

OkeyDokey?

wow cc, I am having fun trying to follow your last message! The wiring on my bike is as per the following diagram - traced them line by line to get the standard set up working. All I am currently trying to do is replace the existing rear end (so to speak!) with a drc edge unit. If you can review and advise what I need to do I really would appreciate it! I am literally connecting the three tail lamp wires shown in the diagram to the ground, tail (including licence plate) and stop lamp wires on the drc unit. Help I am no electrician!!!!!!!!!!

http://s429.photobucket.com/albums/qq14/Andrew1Clarke/

So I understand:

The bike is wired as shown, and it worked as shown for tail/brake (not license lights which you didn't have before).

Correct?

Let's start by assuming less.

What are the wire colors of the LED setup, and what function do they correspond to? You said,

I am literally connecting the three tail lamp wires shown in the diagram to the ground, tail (including licence plate) and stop lamp wires on the drc unit.

The DRC wires are labeled? If not, how do you know which wire coming out of the integrated unit is which?

For the sake of this conversation, avoid saying things like, 'I am literally connecting the three tail lamp wires shown in the diagram...' There are not three tail lamp wires. There is ONE tail lamp wire, one GROUND wire, one STOP lamp wire.


In the diagram, the GREEN wire powers the stop lamp. The BROWN wire is ground. The WHITE wire powers the taillight.

Take the corresponding wires of the DRC unit, hook it to a small battery or battery charger and verify the labeling is correct. Hook 'brown' to (-), then, one at a time, the 'white' and 'green' to the (+).

What happens?

One more thing...the 'rubber booted brake light circuit switch' in the diagram has been verified to be CLOSED correct?

That's a redundant question if the original setup works. I'm asking redundantly.

Better to do this one step at a time...but that would be time consuming.

One other thing: Does the BLACK wire from the rubber booted swtich indeed connect to the YELLOW wire as (I think is) indicated by the faint line between the two with the black DOT on the yellow line?

That's 3X redundant.............

Morning CC,

thanks for taking the time to check it out for me - much appreciated!

OK I will try to be more specific.

The answer to your first question is yes, the tail and stop light work (wired as per diagram) and no licence plate lamp is fitted.

The drc unit has three wires

Red = Stop lamp

Black = Ground

Yellow = Tail and licence plate.

I have checked both the tail/licence plate lamp and the stop lamp individually using a battery and they work as labelled.

The rubber booted brake light switch is indeed closed.

I have had the tail/licence plate lamp lit using the bike AC power but could not get the stop lamp to light at all - unless I swapped the wires and used the tail/licence plate feed to power the stop lamp and then it stayed on all the time (it would as the tail light feed is pernamently on!!)

I hope this is more specific and you can advise me on what to do! Ask any questions and I will happily investigate and revert!

Cheers

Gert

I have had the tail/licence plate lamp lit using the bike AC power but could not get the stop lamp to light at all - unless I swapped the wires and used the tail/licence plate feed to power the stop lamp and then it stayed on all the time (it would as the tail light feed is pernamently on!!)

I hope this is more specific and you can advise me on what to do! Ask any questions and I will happily investigate and revert!

From what you say, the unit is working and no reason to think a different one would act any differently.

A couple of other small steps.....

This is true?

You have the black of the DRC connected to the brown wire.

You have the yellow of the DRC connected to the white wire.

You have the red of the DRC connected to the green wire.

All true?


Try a couple of things. Check with a voltmeter + to the DRC red wire (when connected to the green). What voltage do you measure when you depress the brake pedal?

I presume the DRC connection is taking place while the other lights on the bike are connected?

Unplug your headlight. Any change in the DRC (tail, license and brake)?


This will accomplish a couple of things. The first will tell you if the brake switch is working (if you read an acceptable voltage when actuated). Presumeably you will, as the original setup brake light worked.

The difference between the two is the license plate lights. If the addition of them lowers the available voltage, depressing the brake might not light the brake light. I would expect you would see the other lights at least dim, though. Disconnecting the headlight will take care of that.

There is no resistor nowhere, correct?

And it's goodnight here, so I'll be 'out' for awhile.

Good luck!

cheers cc much appreciated, too early to start bike up here at the moment but will later and revert!

oh, on the resistor front - all there is is what is shown on the diagram

Just for giggles, you might try the opposite (converse? obverse? same way different?). You can take the tail/plate wire and light the stop. Try taking the stop wire and using it to light the tail/plate with the tail/plate wire connected to the brake LED.

Not much to be gained from that, especially if anything previously mentioned sheds light on anything.

It would be interesting to know what the current draw is of the two circuits; brake and tail/plate, but that wouldn't solve the 'no light' problem in the end.

And it had better. The wiring has been checked using a couple of different methods to this point, particularly depending on what the meter shows at the brake connection. The load question will be answered by unplugging the headlight (the 'on' LEDS of the tail/plate won't take as much to STAY on as the brake LED will take to TURN on). If you still come up with nothing in the way of progress in making the brake illuminate.


Is your lighting coil OEM? If taking the headlight out gets you a working brake light, now would be a good time to have one of Inda's light coils sitting in your toolbox waiting to be installed.

Hey! It's WAY past 'too early' by now. Although...it may also not be too early for a couple of pints....so I hope you're doing at least something constructive!


Yet another thing occurs to me. It never hurts to check your grounds. Make sure they are all clean and tight, and any crimped ends/connectors replaced if you have the ends/connectors and enough wire length.

I forgot about the battery/charger route. Take the light coil and regulator out of the circuit, clip in a battery charger (on the load side, 'natch). Use it for testing. No need to actually run the bike until you get what works and what don't sorted out. Any charger 4-6 amps would work fine. Using a battery as a test source adds the chance of crossing up something and frying some wires. A short circuit battery puts out a LOT of current. A short circuit charger (if it's any good at all) will shut down/clamp/stop/quit until the short is removed and the charger is reset.

Hi there CC,

got way laid yesterday - unfortunately no beer involved!!

I am going to run through all the suggestions and checks you have made - today hopefully !! - I will use a battery charger, sounds ideal particularly on the safety front.

Thanks for the support I appreciate your input!

Cheers Gert

Hi CC

the lighting coil is the standard one. I have spotted an aftermarket one in the uk putting out 65W _ I will hold fire on obtaining one pending my investigation lol!!

ok first feed back .....

used the battery charger - great idea wish I had done that sooner!!!

DRC unit - tail, stop and plate lamps work with 12V supply from battery charger. Can activate stop lamp whilst tail lamp is illuminated - nice and bright.

Original tail and stop lamp work with 12V battery charger supply - when feed applied to lamp wiring. Stop and tail work fine.

Going to power the loom with the battery charger and see what works - I will try the original set up first then substitute the DRC unit and see if both the tail and the stop lamp will work.

Presumably I can power up the lighting loom with the battery charger by putting positive feed on the wire which would normally be connected to the lighting coil output and the negative to a frame earth? I will then be able to check original rear light unit and then the DRC unit with the head lamp powered up.

Shout quick if this is not a good idea!

Cheers

Re: 'Presumably I can power up the lighting loom with the battery charger by putting positive feed on the wire which would normally be connected to the lighting coil output and the negative to a frame earth?'

Already wrote:..Take the light coil and regulator out of the circuit,..

You would hook (+) to the yellow wire going to your switch...it being DISconnected from the VR/coil, and, yes..(-) of the charger to a clean spot on the frame, preferably at the same spot the other grounds are connected.

I don't know what the VR would do with a solid DC input, and I wouldn't want to find out.