Which KDX?

[red_eye_righley]

Well, I have to chime in here having owned most of the bikes that are being discussed here: 2 KTM 200exc's, 1 KTM 250mxc, 3 KDX's ('92 200, '98 220, and current '02 220).

When TRAIL riding, the difference between these bikes is quite minimal with prefernces given to each depending on power delivery, suspension, quick turning, light weight, layout, comfort, etc., etc.

But, and this is a big BUT, when you are RACING, the KTM's pull away from the KDX's.

When you are doing a 2-3 hr. fast paced race, the suspension, hydraulic clutch, better ergos, quick throttle response and top notch brakes really shine.

Now, I have raced my KDX 220 in 3 harescrambles and it does fine, but I am riding as a intermediate "B" rider with no intensions of winning or pushing it too much.

In comparison, I have ridden the KTM's in the same races and the more race oriented KTM is just plain better when you start pushing the pace.

Now, my current KDX has '02 KX125 front end w/ revalved forks by Racetech for woods and I have the typical performance mods like FMF pipe, reeds, RB, etc. I also have updated the ergos with IMS wide pegs, tall gripper seat, taller bars, etc. This puts the KDX in the ballpark with the KTM, but it still cant match them when again, things get to race pace.

I have no intention of riding that fast anymore and for me the KDX fits perfect for the few races I do and the mostly trail riding that is what it was built for. The KDX is a more versitile ride IMO and if you are riding really tight, steep terrain, it is hard to find a better bike.

So do you not think that the KX with the KDX engine will be as good as the KTM's? The weight will definately be close to (if not less than) the latest KTM's. Handling on Jap bikes is supposedly better and a modified KDX200 engine is reputed to have better power delivery as well as great power for racing. Theres a guy here who I would say is definately one of the better riders in our country, has had numerous sponsorships. He rides an '09 KTM300 and thinks that this hybrid would be fantastic and at least as good as a KTM200 if not better. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that this will be a great bike, and I suppose I am trying to get everyone to agree before I commit

[KarlP]

I think the KX/KDX is on par with the KTM, that's just me, though.

It'll come down to final setup on the hybrid and rider ability. A well set up KX/KDX won't let YOU down, if you get my drift.

[Indawoods]

I agree with you red_eye_righley!

[red_eye_righley]

Thanks guys. I am on the look out for an engine and a cheap KX. Will get crackin soon. I have found a complete KDX (with some kind of "magneto problem") for cheap. Havent found the KX yet. Can I ask, what has change between 2003 and the latest KX's? It seems that the '05 is slightly different to the '03's? From what I have read here it is the 99-02 model, then the '03 model is "preferred" and is that the same untill now or are the 'o5's also different (and are they preferred?). I am talking abt everything here- not just the build perspective but also about whether the suspension/geometry or anything else has improved or changed. Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks guys. This is a great forum and I hope to be joining team green very soon!!!!

[Indawoods]

The 03 forks turn sharper than all previous years and are not bladdered.

[firffighter]

I have never ridden a hybird, so I would just be guessing about how it would compare to the KTM's.

All bikes have their +'s and -'s.

The KTM comes nicely equipped from the factory and is pretty much ready to race. But, they have their quirks as well. I dont particularly like the suspension all that much and most will say that they "need" a steering stabilizer and a revalve to get it to perform at it's best. They also have different ergos than Japanese bikes and it can take some getting used to. They are pretty finicky about jetting and I have added a JD jet kit to all 3 I owned. The Brembo brakes are nice, but squeal and the front always feels mushy.

Now the KDX hybrid would be a lot of fun for sure. You would have to revalve the suspension for off-road, maybe add a 18" rear wheel. I would choose the 220 motor just because it is more versitile IMO than the 200 motor, and add RB carb/head mod, FMF rev pipe, Boyesen reeds and you've got a really nice ride.

[TWMOODY]

If trying to aquire a 200 motor I'd honestly take whatever I could find cheapest....w/ an emphasis on trying to find an 89-94 one....which should be cheaper regardless.

Why 89-94 over a newer engine ??

Did you not read anything on this thread?[/quote]


Yep I read everything and can't understand why anyone would want to put a 15 year old engine that burns power valve gears in a hybrid

[Indawoods]

KDXButtfry's KDX is a 94.... the power valves are fine in it. CC's has passed a valve through the exhaust before and his is an H model. I think it is a bunch of stuff over nothing myself.

[canyncarvr]

Are you mad...

Yes. I am.

Follows is the list of failures, breakdowns and DNFs I've had with my 10-year old bike:

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

That covers it pretty much.

Oh...in the meantime I have towed, hauled, trailered the other bikes outta' 'da woods.

It's generally considered easier to make the 200 (E or H) perform like the 220 than the other way 'round.

The E engine (that's a 200) in an 'updated' frame would do everything you wanted to do, given:

I ride technical terrain, rocks, roots, hillclimbs etc, the tighter the better ..

The H 200 will, too..with a bit more tuning.

I also got passed quite handily by a guy on a KDX in a recent race.

Here's some 'old school' for 'ya: Any race, ride, toot, or fun ride is more about the rider...less..MUCH less about the bike.

If 'you' (generally speaking) can't keep up in technical terrain with a KDX, maybe YOU should consider some 'new school'ing yourself.

They work. They're dependable.

If you would prefer riding a fruit (or is it a vegetable? ) you're more'n welcome to it. Heck...a new punkin is only $7000 and change. Piece 'o cake!

[red_eye_righley]

The 03 forks turn sharper than all previous years and are not bladdered.

I spose thats a good thing then for the technical stuff. Any other changes/differences? Should I worry about getting a 2003 bike if I cant find one and can only get and '04 or later? Were '04 onwards all identical or were there some subtle changes?

[red_eye_righley]

Guys, you have given me a new lease on life. I am spending every waking moment scouring the nett for seized bikes ( I think I am going to start going to the odd MX event in town here with a few packets of sugar....jks). I will hear today about whether I can get hold of some bike parts from a KDX (including engine). A guy was given this pile of KDX parts from an "05 model KDX and its been sitting in his garage - hopefully I get lucky.....If I get it cheap enough I will just try and get myself a cheapish running KX. One more question: I read this article on one of our local dirt bike forums where they reference an article saying how poorly the KX250 from 2006/7 untill now handles - will this apply to the 125 too? I really cant believe it, people do pretty well on standard KX250's around here in the enduro's - surely it cant be as terrible as this articles says. I could tell you what forum its on - its opento have a look but dunno if that would be a bad thing in terms of forum etiquette and all that - if you want to see and its ok just lemme know and I will post it up or PM a link (whichever is acceptable). Cheers guys, thanks for the advice!!!!
Oh, re the piece of fruit being expensive - that is one reason, and the fact taht I could do ok on a bik ethat is a little unusual is also a nice thought. I really think that this will be a good alround bike (maybe leaning more towards the technical stuff than the fast stuff - which is great, depending on tuning and setup of course) and cant wait to find parts and get building!!!

[kawagumby]

About the E vs H model 200's...I rode an 89 model for several years and raced it a lot in that time period, bone stock other than front-end suspension mods. I loved the engine - when I bought a newly introduced 95 KDX200 to replace it I was disappointed with the engine because it did not have enough low end to cleanly meke some of the nasty hills on my favorite single-track loop. I felt the 220 engine was similar to my old 89 200.... that's why I switched to the 220 later on. To repeat what everyone says here, it's the kind of riding you do that makes the choice, not which engine is best. I never had a power valve go bad with my 89 model, but did strip the plastic gears that move them once (hundreds of hours on it by then). That was before they made power valve specific blends of pre-mix that reduce the amount of gunk build-up. I'd bet you'd never have that problem today. (that bike is still going strong - I sold it to my niece who raced it for about 4 years, it disappeared for a few more then turned up at a dual-sport ride in northern california last year - converted to a legal dual-sport! It was easy to identify with certain graphics and showa front-end on it.)

BTW, the bottom ends haven't changed significantly since the air-cooled days and are all bullet-proof IMO.

PS IMHO any modern bike will handle well once you dial it in.

[Wazowski]

Hi Guys, it's certainly been a while.

If you remember I got out of riding and sold my 220,but latly I've been missin' my KDX. Anyway I ran across one here locally and wondering if it would be a good buy.


It's a 1993 KDX 200 with upgraded forks, pipe and silencer etc.

Will I be as happy with this as I was my '03 220?

The guys asking $1200 which means he'd likely take $1000 cash.

Any comments/thought?

Thanx.

Wazowski

[KarlP]

Welcome back, Waz


"It's generally considered easier to make the 200 (E or H) perform like the 220 than the other way 'round."

Why would one want to try to make a 220 run like a 200?

Sounds like a downgrade, to me.....

[firffighter]

Yep,

My '92 200 w/ RB carb, FMF pipe and Boyesen reeds was a nice combo and worked well in the Colton type terrain. I rode it several times at the Burn and it performed great. I was about to add a FWW to make it even better for tight woods, but sold it off.

I think my 220 has a bit more torque, but not too far off from the 200E.

Get the bike quick so you can show me around the Colton riding

I live in Estacada and would love to learn that area!

[red_eye_righley]

The 89-94 200 motor is known to be a better stump puller than the 95-up 200's, and would be what I'd go after if building a hybrid.

Guys, it seems this statement is accepted as "the verdict" to this question. My next question, how much of the top end does it not have that the later motor has to offer? I mean, I know I said that I ride technical stuff, but there is still plenty oppurtunity to use the top end in any race really. So, if I am still wanting a motor that has the "racey" feel/performance would the newer motor not be better? I have found a complete '94 model 200 for cheap "needs new piston and rings" but thats fine as I want to rebuild the motor anyway. I just want to make 100% sure that I am getting the correct motor for me (my gut feel tells me that is probably the newer engine and that I should keep looking)....thanks, have a good weekend
PS: will be riding with a group of KDX riders this weekend (and my pumpkin makes them suffer on the steep rocky switchback hills - no, it isnt the bike, they are still newish riders - I will be riding a coupla KDX's this weekend ).

[fuzzy]

The 89-94's still scream up top. Enough motor to way overpower the chassis it was hooked to(stock).

Keep in mind that ALL the KDX motors have reached end of life. Parts will be around for a long time though I'm sure.

[red_eye_righley]

Awesome, now my only worry is that if I buy this lump I can get it up and running with no surprises. Will have a looksee before I commit though. Thanks guys!